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Post by Ohio on Dec 15, 2003 12:11:50 GMT -5
Its nice to see the rest of the world blame the US for their problems. As many billions of dollars the US gives in support to the rest of the world, one would think we would be a little more appreciated. Instead you take our handout and then look for ways to stab us in the back. WHY? And you look at the leader of our country as the antichrist. And all your reasons for hating him are based on liberal media rubbish and have no factual base. And now I hate you for making me sound like Rush Limbaugh.
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Post by Ohio on Dec 15, 2003 12:15:08 GMT -5
Please explain how it was illegal z00ey
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z00ey
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Post by z00ey on Dec 15, 2003 12:17:59 GMT -5
Its nice to see the rest of the world blame the US for their problems. As many billions of dollars the US gives in support to the rest of the world, one would think we would be a little more appreciated. Instead you take our handout and then look for ways to stab us in the back. WHY? And you look at the leader of our country as the antichrist. And all your reasons for hating him are based on liberal media rubbish and have no factual base. And now I hate you for making me sound like Rush Limbaugh. i never blamed bush for any other problems that he made ..and for things he involves the whole world in. ..and again: no one wants him to do it ! (well, a part of the ppl who voted for him maybe..)
bush is not the antichrist !!! ..he is worse ;\ (quote bush "holy crusaide against terror")
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z00ey
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Post by z00ey on Dec 15, 2003 12:20:43 GMT -5
Please explain how it was illegal z00ey well.. before bush changed the world in a bad way a war (starting a war to be exactly) was only legal if the united antions said yes, simple as that. (now every leader and his dog can start "preventive" wars cause they feel threatened (allready happens in russia at the mo(tschetschenien)))
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Post by Ohio on Dec 15, 2003 12:26:06 GMT -5
But why did the UN vote no, So countries like France, Germany and Russia could hide the fact that they were violating UN resolutions by selling arms to Iraq, loaning Saddam money, selling him technology. Yeah, I would not want the rest of the world to know I was a 2 faced rat either.
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Post by Lazer on Dec 15, 2003 12:33:33 GMT -5
if you ask me its gonna cause more trouble than there was before i mean look at it this way.
there is still alot of ppl on his side so there gonna take loads of ppl hostage and use them with "free saddam and we will free the ppl" i will guarantee it there will be rosygarden loads going on
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Post by Freak on Dec 15, 2003 12:37:58 GMT -5
lmao guantanamo was better living conditions then any of them had ever experienced. what are we supposed to do give them a hotel room? as for the war i think calling it illegal is another attempt to hide behind the un as an all powerful. UN is great for countries since with it they can talk alot of rosygarden and feel protected. the difference being that these countries rely on their allies for protection while the us is the protection. example being you would never see a german base in the US. so now that i have talked rosygarden and offended everyone ill wait for your rebuttle
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Post by Cope on Dec 15, 2003 12:38:54 GMT -5
Something that has alread been said. Short term we will be worse off. Long term it will help.
Sorry that I got you so upset z00ey because I dont agree with everything you say. Did we support saddam..yeah we did. Everything you point out as far as us supporting old Iraq, Bin Laden...ect ect had not a thing to do with Bush. If you dont remember Clinton was pres for 8 years. He didnt do a thing wrong did he? Perfect example of foreign policy in his years as pres right?
I dont mind having a discussion about anything. But dont tell me to read up. or make some other smart a** comment about how I know nothing. I do read up. I prefer to look back further than 1 year to get my information.
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z00ey
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Post by z00ey on Dec 15, 2003 12:45:51 GMT -5
But why did the UN vote no, So countries like France, Germany and Russia could hide the fact that they were violating UN resolutions by selling arms to Iraq, loaning Saddam money, selling him technology. Yeah, I would not want the rest of the world to know I was a 2 faced rat either. the "why" was not the point - and is not the point: from that day on the idea of the united nations is not worth a sh|t anymore.. ..you may think about the consequences yourself. footnote: it wasn t only the majority of who could vote, it was also the majority of all states represented there (like 90% if i remember right, don t nail me down on it).
talking about two faced rats: no country in the whole world made more buisiness and gave more support to saddam hussein than the united states of america (reagen,bush,bush). yes, france and germany and many others countries made buisiness with iraq too (we all need oil like a junkiy needs heroin - a shame, i know).. BUT.. it was a well published and documented here, even before the war started, no need to hide or cover everything: it was definatly not a reason for voting against that war.
quote of a two faced rat that still claims saddam had anything to do with 9/11 or even would be a direct thread for the usa: "thank you all, you are doing a great job here so we all can leave in piece at home" (bush, thanksgiving this year). see how he still tries that funny propaganda allthough even papers like the conservative New York Times titled about the "leetest" trick of the bush admistration: making the us ppl believe that saddam is a thread.
and talking about terrorism (which had nothing to do with the iraq problem): he did nothing but push the problem, i have to agree, lazer.
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z00ey
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Post by z00ey on Dec 15, 2003 12:50:43 GMT -5
lmao guantanamo was better living conditions then any of them had ever experienced. what are we supposed to do give them a hotel room? as for the war i think calling it illegal is another attempt to hide behind the un as an all powerful. UN is great for countries since with it they can talk alot of rosygarden and feel protected. the difference being that these countries rely on their allies for protection while the us is the protection. example being you would never see a german base in the US. so now that i have talked rosygarden and offended everyone ill wait for your rebuttle here is your reply: i am not talking about the living conditions there (only),, read up about what s happening there =]
just a hint: the ppl who are prisoned their (against ALL existing laws, even us laws ( that s why they are not within the usa !!)) haven t even been accused of anything !!!!
footnote: isn t it funny that the nation who started "cruisades" (bush) all over the world in the name of democracy managed it to get into the top three of amnesty international ?!
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Post by Duke Tosti on Dec 15, 2003 12:53:05 GMT -5
Ohio and z00ey ... STOP ! before this thread is more pages than pashy's parlour ;D Ohio and z00ey discussing is one of the biggest ramp scenarios possible for the servers of proboards 1 weird thing that surprised me was that only 2 other people were with him when he was hiding. When you have the whole US/Australian Army after you, I would have thought you'd need alot more then 2 people to protect you, but it seems like he didn't mind going down without a fight. I think that's because if he was with 1000 ppl around him to 'protect' him, he would have been traced way more easy, a secret hideout is no longer secret if more then one person knows about it ... sometimes weapons and lots of ppl wearing them aren't the best protection probably the worst in this case ;D but to get back to where Ohio and z00ey are arguing right now ... there are always more point of views on a certain conflict, I don't think u can blame USA for everything ... here in Holland we use to call them 'stupid' sometimes, because of their attitudes towards 'freedom' and 'democracy', they throw with this words so d**n often, u wonder if they ever think of anything else, but they probably do ... keeping the oil trade going (and achieve it cheaply) is most of the times the underlying though when talking about democracy and freedom, when looking at the news it's better to $replace(when bush talks,freedom,make sure we keep our oil,democracy,make sure the countries that produce oil owe us something), that's why they've helped the Taliban and Saddam in earlier years, to keep the countries stable so that oil trade would not be interupted ... but not only the USA benefits from this, eventually also Germany, France, and other countries besides the USA allied countries like Spain, UK, the Netherlands and others, profit from stable oil prices and a 'power base' in the centre of the Arabian countries, if Iraq ever becomes stable under it's current government (or another) it wouldn't trouble anyone, it even can be everyne will start saying the USA handled quite well in this conflict ... and that all for the oil ... and besides ... saddam was a flowerchild, he murdered ppl, threw his country in an eight year war against iran, and starts with the use of chemical weapons in this war, that's terrible ... so the USA did the right thing in my opinion, get rid of the dictator (allthough they did it a bit late), that they maybe did this with the wrong motives (oil) is only a side point, they really helped the people in Iraq to get rid of saddam, but I think it's more hypocrite of the countries as Germany and France; start being nice again when everything returns to normal, so that they can have oil too ... and their motive is probably the same, their economies also dón't work proper without relativly cheap oil what america does wrong, is letting foreign militaries controll everything, they should start building an intern and with iraqi filled millitary and police system, u get the idea probably, u should think the usa learned some things from vietnam anyways ... and I also saw z00ey type about kyoto ... germany still mines for brown coal (if that's how u call it in english) ... using that stuff in industrial processes instead of older coal (black coal) isn't that clean neither ;D but I agree environmental isseus and the USA are a bit hypocryte too ... if they put a bit more effort in it they could be way more clean without even noticing the difference in tax payments and such, americans spoil such a lot, use so much fuel and energy, that it looks like the don't care what happens to their children or the children of others (or broader, what happes to the future of the world) so in case of bush ... I don't like him neither, just in order to keep his votes he won't sign kyoto ... I hate such men but to keep the rest short, in an internatiol conflict there are NEVER only two players in the whole game, germany plays its part in the iraq issue as well as the USA does, only the future can learn who is 'right' (read; who can talk his or her mistakes into looking 'right' best) politics suck anyway ...
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Post by Freak on Dec 15, 2003 12:54:32 GMT -5
there is a law z00ey. and it is not right to use it in this case but those prisoners can be considered pow's or prisoners of war. they can be held there as long as the war continues and if bush wants to say they are pow's of the war on terrorism then they will be there a long time. right or wrong.
/me btw bush is a moron!
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z00ey
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Post by z00ey on Dec 15, 2003 12:56:22 GMT -5
"sorry that I got you so upset z00ey because I dont agree with everything you say. Did we support saddam..yeah we did. Everything you point out as far as us supporting old Iraq, Bin Laden...ect ect had not a thing to do with Bush. If you dont remember Clinton was pres for 8 years. He didnt do a thing wrong did he? Perfect example of foreign policy in his years as pres right?"
hey ..no need to say sorry, i m not really upset, just @topic because i like to discuss sometimes too.
and yes, i do remeber the clinton years, he actually handled it much better, he was looking for the long distance much more.
i actually looked back till early 80ies,, ,,and bushs politcs is a directly starts where reagans,bush sr. ended, that s why he has a lot to do with the politics , he does the same mistakes all over again (clinton wasn t ,inside the usa and outside, that s why i left him out).
ps: it wasn t meant to be a samrt-ass comment, truly.
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z00ey
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Post by z00ey on Dec 15, 2003 12:59:21 GMT -5
there is a law z00ey. and it is not right to use it in this case but those prisoners can be considered pow's or prisoners of war. they can be held there as long as the war continues and if bush wants to say they are pow's of the war on terrorism then they will be there a long time. right or wrong. /me btw bush is a moron! bush declared the war officially as ended (same as in afghanistan).. ..allthough we all know that both wars will last for a long time : even the pow theory is not possible though.
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z00ey
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Post by z00ey on Dec 15, 2003 13:01:14 GMT -5
..oh.. and even prisoners of war WOULD have certain rights.
ps: sorry, too lazy to load plugins and java right now, can t modify posts ;p
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