CHAT Servers / Rooms / Clients ...

[.•´¯`•þasђγ•._.•´]

overdose no one is saying opinions arent valid. and of course in life people have to learn to accept criticism and bad reviews.

but it's all about the delivery of those opinions. criticism can be constructive when it is delivered correctly. telling ppl to burn their modems and computers etc etc is not constructive criticism - isnt even opinion, it's just rubbish.

most of the suggestions about layouts etc were great ! it's just a pity that a lot of those comments were delivered in such harsh manners.


btw. this is NOT directed at comments made specifically by you. just the whole of the thread.

[overdose]

Yea well I don't think mine were unfair... I'm not going to change them because it's what I believe. Either read them or ignore them, I don't mind. But I have every right to say them. They weren't 'personal attacks'.

[эך|χэ]

Well Axel, kustom & overdose if you read Michio's posts instead of just looking at his work & slagging it off you might of seen that it was just something to start off with & that after reading about his breaking there copywrite he decided to contact MSN & show them what he made. MSN replied & said he was able to use there source code but he had to change the butterfly.
He is only trying to create something as similar to MSN as he can, not for the three of you l33t0 scripting h4x0r genius's who has never used anyone else's code & always written your own. But for everyone who aint so l33t0 that has to suffer through MSN's decision to close user created chat to under 18's & the non presciber.
As far as I have ever witnessed not many 15 year olds are quite up to date on copywrite law. So if you think you can do better than what he has done, instead of writting pointless abusive posts how about use that energy to make something yourselves otherwise unless you have shares in Microsoft you've had your say so put a lid on it.

[overdose]

Yea ok.... I'm sorry then. Good luck with GWC...

[эך|χэ]

Oh & btw CalSingle ......AMEN!!!

[CalSingle]

pashingflower,

You have an excellent attitude and frame of mind. Nice to see intelligent posts that are centered on others welfare and benefit.

eXile,

LOL ... was shocked myself when I saw my original. Just couldn't hold back any longer.

overdose said:

Yea well I don't think mine were unfair... I'm not going to change them because it's what I believe. Either read them or ignore them, I don't mind. But I have every right to say them. They weren't 'personal attacks'.

If you're going to make a statement like this ^^^ , try following it yourself. Start reading and ignoring, let the rest of search for comments of value on the board. TRY the PM function, I'm sure the experts can all shake their fists and heads together there.

IN GENERAL,
This thread has done an excellent job of proving my point. Thank you to those who continue input of value ... and the rest who can't seem to live without getting the last and controversial word in ... I'm sure we'll hear more from you. <sigh>

[glow=yellow,2,300]Cal[/glow]

[Ryan]

i ALREADY READ ONE LONG POST SO THE REST CAN BURGER OFF One long post per thread is my limit i have to goto college and stuff ya know lol

[Ender]

I do understand the thought that people do need some form of chatting that they can relate to. MSN made chatting quite easy for those who aren't computer-framed minded ("experts" as some would call them). Many of the scripters on these forums haven't even been doing it for more than 2 years; by far..they're not experts. Instead they're people who can adapt to change. Believe it or not, it's just as hard for "MSN Scripting experts" to change to a different server as someone who hadn't the faintest about any server. You may ask why?

It's a whole different world. Their scripts that they've spent so long on no longer work. That's why there have been comments regarding Nightstorm's and I's server to an IRCX-format (which technically is how MSN runs minus the webchat). Now keep in mind, many MSN scripters don't know anything about IRCd. People bug about mode changes, bans, services...they're newbies again. No longer are they "1337" or "Experts". Instead they're newbies like everyone else. Just that they know how to tinkle with mIRC to make scripts. I see no reason why people think that many MSN scripters can just up and go from MSN without any problem whatsoever. Still, at this time ..people on the server that I'm an Admin on ask about mode changing or why certain things happen. It's all new to them as it would be all new to anyone else.

It would be easy if everything else were easy. I know that makes little sense. But as I've been decompiling, patching, testing, decompiling, patching, testing for countless hours...it's not all that it's cr*cked up to be. Sure, it's easy to get the webchat interface through an application (viva la Webagent). But I don't want people to have to download a full client to connect to an IRC room (hey, was that how it was on MSN? nay). I'm not trying to emulate MSN, instead I'm trying to grasp their ease and make it how people will be able to do as they wish. That is not easy. Nor will it ever be easy. Some are making clones of MSN, some are making websites in hopes that it'll be like MSN, and others are just using MSN's business practices as a means of advertising theirselves as a server.

Do you know how many servers are preparing for this day? Quakenet and DALNet just to name a few. Quakenet has become more tolerant of staffing applications. DALnet supposively is going to have more tutorials to teach newbie mIRC users as to how to use services and other useful tools of an IRCd server. This change of MSN is effecting alot of people; not just users, not just MSN scripters, but people all over the internet in the chatting realm. People are trying, they really are. However, trying and copying are two different things.

I like the idea of trying to emulate MSN's ease of service. However, I dislike the idea of being exactly like MSN. It's MSN for crying out loud. The only people that are going to be exactly MSN is MSN itself. These clone server applications and websites are a coming out of the woodworks. I like that people are trying to expand their minds while working on such things. SilentSoft is expanding their horizons while learning how to emulate a protocol (via IRCXPro style), "GWC" is [hopefully] learning to code their own website instead of taking MSN's (regardless of any authorization they may have recieved, it's just asking for those who aren't mature enough to just state an opinion to flame), and various others that are trying to learn and adapt to help others through this change. At times, I feel like watching this board is like watching the blind leading the blind. While other times it feels like it's going somewhere.

Coming to the forum under different nicknames and just asking for trouble didn't help GWC's claim either (see "Rear Ender" and "T7" ..and "Haha/mooooooob"). However, that's a forum issue instead of something that is on the personal level.

This is my opinion...even Overdose understands that I don't agree with him all the way...even Exile understands this. The thing is, since everyone goes back and forth bashing one another..they refuse to see their enemy's side or opinion. Taking things as "face value" isn't all it's cr*cked up to be. However, "reading between the lines" sometimes is effective.

Edit
Actually, 90%+ scripters do use other's coding somewhere in their existance. Either to learn from or to rip from. That's just how people learn is by example. That doens't make them 1337 if they don't...1337 is just...well, 1337

I'm sure you'll freak out looking at one of my long posts -again- Ryan. lol.

[overdose]

Yea I understand, maybe some of you didn't read my post

overdose said:

Yea ok.... I'm sorry then. Good luck with GWC...

I said what I've said... I'll move on with life.

[overdose]

I SAID I WAS SORRY

Clear enough?

[Waxel]

"MSN replied & said he was able to use there source code but he had to change the butterfly."


I dont believe that at all.

[Draconis]

You know, I probably would have been a whole lot more accepting to this attempt at a MSN Website clone, if not for one thing.
As Axel just pointed out, when I asked if they had obtained permission to use an exact rip of MSN's webpages, I was told that yes, the owner had received permission... which I know for a fact is BS. It's one thing to say "oops... no, we didn't think we would have to, but are only trying to make something familiar to others". It's another thing to come right out and lie about the fact, and then go on the defensive when they get called on it.
Dynasty asked for people's opinions, and tried to show off the chat page. And that was exactly what was posted on the thread. Sorry some others don't like what they saw, or what came out... but you know, when you break copyright and then lie about it claiming it as your own (copyright notice in the lower left of the page claimed all content as theirs), you're bound to get some people telling you that you're stealing content. it is then that one should take the comments, look them over, and change any content to fit the suggestions (read: remove material owned by another). Slinging back verbal abuse because you got what you asked for is just childish... something I would expect from my 7 year old before some 15 year old who is supposed to be a server staff member.
One little comment that people should think about, since everyone is off joining the "I got my own server" bandwagon.
The actions and comments of your staff will be a direct example of how your server is run.
Think on it.

[overdose]

Which was my point the whole time... the fact that they copyrighted it before even writing to MSN...

[Ohio]

OMG!! Some one ripped the worlds most famous ripper?
(Yes microsoft is the worlds most famous ripper for those of you to involved with yourself to come out of your shell)

Other than that, All I have to say is you all suck. With the exception of David, Ozzy, Pashingflower, Calsingle and eXile and any one else that was not a peckerhead about the whole thing. The rest of you, regardless of your age or upbringing need to grow up. Stop being jealous of someone that makes an effort to do something when their entire effort is based solely not on personal gain, but bringing joy and comfort to others. The "I am going to prove I am right and you suck and I am going to be the biggest corksucker about it possible" attitude just shows everyone else how little your opinion is worth. So Axel, overdose and the rest of you, since I think you are nothing but worthless spammers, should I follow you around the forum and post after every post of yours with "You suck spammer"? Would that be ok? Some of you are very lucky that I don't have the power to ban you from this fourm, quite frankly I am tired of reading your insults and ego inflated BS.

[overdose]

Do what you wish .

And did you not read my 2 previous posts Ohio or are you blind? I do believe I said sorry.